Not to be obnoxious, but...If the vote for governor was today, and I based my vote soley on who mentioned God and talked about his or her faith...
I would vote for Jennifer Granholm. Too bad for Mr. De Vos, he even claims to be a Reformed Christian.
12 comments:
Granholm was the only one asked a question where one could reasonably be expected to mention God. DeVos took the Christian position on abortion, homosexual marriage and stem cell research. I don't think it's necessary for him to drop the name of God just to drop it when he's taking positions that clearly have their root in scripture.
Mr. Birn, I concur. Nate... ah. Never mind.
NL
When asked about WHY he held to these positions from our dear governess- DeVos basically said two things:
1. He is not outside of the mainstream.
2. He holds to these positions BECAUSE he has a conscience.
All men have a conscience- but not all men have been enlightened by the Word of God. So which is it? Conscience or because it is rooted in the Word of God?
We have a couple of other debates- then I will cast my lot with the one that my conscience will allow. :)
I think DeVos was responding more to what Granholm had said of him than he was responding to the actual question asked. I think it utterly idiotic to ignore the fact that he takes the Biblical position simply because he didn't name drop. You can't seriously believe that because Granholm mentioned God when asked about the 10 commandments in the Capitol building that she's somehow a Christians while DeVos is not.
DeVos wasn't asked about his faith and he wasn't asked about anything associated with the Christian faith. His answers were entirely acceptable given the circumstances. Christians need not vote for the man who runs around screaming about God all day long, DeVos takes a more subtle approach to it, mentioning it only offhand. This is in stark contrast to the screaming ninnys of the evangelical movement who won't stop talking about God on the campaign trail.
It's clear that DeVos is a Christian, he's talked about his faith in several major speeches and he takes the Christian, scriptural position on every major social issue. Furthermore, we see his Christian fruits in the amount of money he gives to various Christian charities and in his refusal to give money for certain stem cell research. Scripture teaches us that we will know a man by his fruits, the fruits of Dick DeVos are quite clear. The fact that he doesn't go on and on about God in a political debate is perfectly acceptable, if not preferable considering some of the loons that have run for office and embaressed the Christian faith (read: Robertson, Falwell etc.)
On another note, don't let your distaste for the CRC blind you to what DeVos does on the campaign trail. DeVos is a good Christian man whose fruits can be seen all over Grand Rapids. He's positions are Biblical, what more do you want? He's a member of the CRC, he attends church every Sunday. He's professed to be a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ, the fruits of which are quite apparent. The CRC may not be the most super terriffic denomination but it's better than most and it's certainly better than whatever Granholm claims she is. Let's not hold our disagreements with the CRC against a good Christian man such as DeVos.
In a sense this post was with tongue-in-cheek, but I often am annoyed with Christian 'lesser of two evils' politics.
I would assume that Devos is a Christian- he professes that. Granholm also professes it though- she may be Catholic, but it is within the bounds of what we call Christian- Trinitarian Christianity.
I am okay with someone not spewing their Christianity at all points, but when he mentioned the stem cell, abortion, etc. comment it was a perfect time to mention that his faith in Christ shapes those beliefs. It is more than morality and conscience.
As for the CRC- sure it is still a Reformed Church, but it has been cut off from NAPARC (Association of Presbyterian and Reformed Churches). I always find a difficulty in my mind (and this may be to my fault- I am not sure) to make acceptions for these Churches when it comes to politics and the sphere of our faith.
The CRC thing is not my issue with DeVos, but why are so many on board with the CRC when it is running for office, but when they would never attend one due to their ideas of apostacy.
Anyway, I hope that DeVos does stand up for Christ in the next two debates. I am hoping.
First of all, I think that Nathan was obviously joking. He would never vote for Granholm. ;)
Second, let us not get confused when it comes to good morals and biblical principles. To be a Republican and take the views Rebulicans generally stand for, you need not be a Christian.
Thirdly, this has nothing to do with the CRC. It has to do with living out a life to the glory of God. Church attendance alone is not enough. I don't believe that Nathan mentioned anything re: the CRC or his dislikes thereof.
Fourth, Nathan never made claim to Devos' faith. We both just find it odd that a professing believer does not mention his Lord during a debate. If his life revolves around Christ, I don't know how one would avoid it. I realize that it is a hard thing to do in politics...there is too much compromising that would have to take place...
Fifth, Nathan never said Granholm was a Christian. He simply stated that base SOLELY on the mention of GOD....he would vote.....
Sixth, Nathan is not "idiotic" and calling upon the name of the Lord is not "name-dropping."
Seventh, I got a nice letter in the mail from Devos' daughter stating how great he is, but yet no mention of the Lord or his faith. (just thought I would add that)
Eighth, I really wanted to stay out of this. I just want fellow Christians to understand that I do believe it is important to vote on the side that holds to "biblical" principles, yet we need not defend until we are blue in the face that the running parties may be God-fearing. Just because one is moral means nothing except less sinning.
Ninth, I did not in anyway state that DeVos is not a Christian. Let's make that clear. I don't want to have the argument again. I vote based on views that I find important and that the party claims to uphold. Not so much on the character of the person. (Although, if the character of the Republican running was disgusting, then I would just not vote.)
Finally, many, many, many people give money to charity. This is not a fruit alone. Christians are to give, but not all that give are Christians. Let us not confuse kindness, morals, charity, church attendance with Christianity. The fear of the Lord, the obeying of his commandments, the belief that Christ is our Savior, the living out our lives to the glory of God....
These "fruits" come along with the Xn life, but are not what "gets you to heaven."
Let us defend the Republicans versus Democrats but not get confused with the Christians versus the nonChristians.
Furthermore, as the American colonies had been under English jurisdiction at the time of the Solemn League, the United States was held as responsible to uphold the Covenants. Since the Constitution contains no reference to Christ or to the Covenants, Reformed Presbyterians refused to vote, hold governmental office, serve on juries, or swear any oath of loyalty to the Unites States government or any lower government, and Canadian members similarly refrained from such activities. Members who did participate in the political process would typically be disciplined by their congregational session. Although these principles were held firmly for many decades, the official denominational position was changed, beginning in the 1960s; by 1969, the official position allowed members to vote and run for office. Some members yet continue the historic dissenting positions, but the majority of members participate like members of other conservative Christian denominations.
"not to be obnoxious, but"
That is the best part of your whole post, natey.
hey, at least your not in Jersey with our state government...
I've voting for Ted Nugent regardless.
Falwell talks about God and his faith, too, but I wouldn't vote for him. I think I'd rather have a few more "Cool Cities."
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